About the IMA proposal / Au sujet de la proposition de l'IMA

Looking forward to reach 100% agreement ;-)

People lets wait and see,dont go,if we were here from the start of this story we can stay to the end,unfortunatelly we lost a few people in this transitioning time and i understand that people are sick of this play but lets be patient for the last time.

Thank you for this update

Hello Christophe, I hope you've prepared appointments with your lawyer as well as with your solicitor already? Because under French law such announcements like above are worth not a penny. Least of all, after so much trust has been destroyed by your neverending back and forth within the last weeks.

What is that magical 1%? Is it important, or not? Within IMA it's unknown until this moment (24th of April 2017, 14:25 CET). But of course it has to be discussed, before you may go to your lawyer to prepare the indispensable pre-contract, called Promesse de Vente in France.

Under French law only such an undersigned Promesse de Vente is of legal relevance. As a French businessman you know it very well. It has to be undersigned by you and your solicitor not later than upcoming Friday morning.

I hope you've realized, that neither IMA nor you are still sitting on the drivers seat. Generosity does! On Friday, 28th of April, 2017, 12:00 o'clock CET, the deadline of the crowdfunding will end. You know that since many weeks! Neither IMA nor you can change that date. Afterwards the crowdfunding money will be refunded automatically. Once away, those 29.130 USD will never come back. That's it.

Thank you for that very illuminating comment. I hope Christophe is reading it at this moment. He only has 5 more days to secure a legal deal and prevent the return of the crowd funding monies.

This at first seems a hopeful announcement by Christophe, but there is still a huge BUT ....

Thankyou for that information !!

Not holding my breath

Dear Amalia, I don't know, wheather the deadline is a computer generated one - i.e. April 30th, midnight - or if it is operated by people, working for generosity. I even don't know, wheather IMAs decision wheather the money has to be refunded or not will be processed within the French bureau, or within the Californian headquarter. (William knows, but he is at work, and not allowed to communicate private things from his working place.)

But I'm very sure, that 'normal' French lawyers and solicitors doesn't like to work at Saturdays. Additionally a certain time is necessary, to serve the undersigned Pre-Contract to IMAs French representative (Eric Desjours) by an express delivery boy. Therefore let's assume Friday, 28th, 12:00 MEZ as the deadline.

What means: time-out is in 3 days and 16 hours up from this moment.

" Therefore let's assume Friday, 18th, 12:00 MEZ as the deadline. "

Friday, 18th ??

I'm tired. Sorry. Friday 28th, of course!

Understandable.
Take care of yourself !

IMA has done its best. Now get some rest, we will see what comes out of all this, we keep supporting and are very thankfull for all your (IMA) efforts.

Hi Bernhard,

If refunds are made, they will be processed in California. This is the reason IMA currently has a series of 0s in the "Swift" bank field. This will prevent the transfer of the funds to IMA's French bank account. If the transfer was made, it would be next to impossible to keep our word and refund members if the deal does not go through since we do not have access to credit card numbers.

Ok, I understand.
Thank you!

Do you ever manage to get any sleep at the moment, William? My hope is that your hard work will pay off, and that Christophe won't throw the bay out with the bathwater.

At this stage it is so unfair and bad business practice on Christoiphe's part to treat William and the IMA team in the manner bin which he is doing. Too agree to accepted IMA's proposal and then Change his mind 2 days later.
It is also unfair on the loyal members of IP/SA to treat us this way.
He appears to be ruthless and uncaring. Don't like or trust this Guys behavior.

Hi Christophe,
sounds good, thanks for your message. :)
All the best to you!

Curious about this 1 % !!!!!

Having been a project/program manager in the aerospace industry for over 25 years I have learned two lessons (among others of course)
1. If they tell you it is 95% complete, expect another 95% of the cost / effort
2. If they tell you it is 99% complete, they do not know what they are talking about ;-)
Let's see what will be the next surprise.

Exactly, you have not caught the fish until it is on your plate, or put another way, how do you sell the skin while the bear is still in it.

Absolutely true !

!!!

Don't get it ., He agreed to let IMA take the IP platform and then renaged on that. Now 99% sure.???????????? So it's a wait and see game. Hope this time he keeps his promise

Thanks for the update.

Thank you for the update!

Being patient is difficult --- yet, it is a MUST.

We are not / nor should we as Members be in on every discussion / agreement / disagreement / workings involved in the comments from CR or IMA.---

We have been patient this long - -- -

Can't y'all hold on a bit longer for something wonderful ?

To phrase it a little differently --- not everything is our business. William / IMA - Christophe have been negotiating, not us.

Let it finish, My Friends ... let if finish.. ....

Christophe has the opportunity to make good on his word...

As yet.... I won't hold my breath... he has stalled too many times.

We have to see the last act of the play performed yet.

Agreed. I will believe it when it happens and not until then.

Thank you Christophe for the update, but please pardon me if I say, "I believe it when I see it".

+1

I hope so, but who knows ...

REPORTED KARL ANDERSON ABOVE AS A TROLL BREAKING GUIDELNES

Not expecting anyone to remove him... Audrey may or may not be there. !!

Its incredible,how for christ sake they sniff where trouble is...

Marko my friend.. they are dirt dwelling trolls... when your nose is hard pressed to the ground.... you smell all kinds of things !!!

Great Pam. I blocked him as soon a I got an email from him. Ipernity seem to have left the building. Explore has not been updated for at least a week. And not replies to emails either.

merci christophe pour ces précisions ......ce serait tellement merveilleux que votre site ne meurt pas, et pour vous et pour nous tous !!

CHRISTOPHE: THANK YOU FOR THE UPDATE!! It has been hard to have no communication from you directly (though I understand why)

People please, I know we are all frustrated at this process, but it is a complex one. Try and remember that Christophe is one of the main reasons that this site exists in the first place. I hope that if you ever have to do something like this that people are patient and kind to you.

I am thrilled that we still are up and running and am posting and commenting to enjoy the site.

Yes...

Can anybody add a true German translation? I only have Babylon translator and it isn't good for this.

Ich wäre auch sehr dankbar wenn es Neuigkeiten immer auch in deutsch geben würde.

Lischen, I'll try my verybest!

Au wei, jetzt war ich noch in der anderen Sprachwelt, weil ich gerade englisch getippt hab. Ich glaub, ich brauch mal ne Pause und frische Luft. Tippe hier schon seit 05:30 mit bisher nur einer Tasse kaffe und zwei Stückchen Schokolade. . . .

Also: Luzt und ich sind die beiden einzigen Deutschen innerhalb der IMA. Lutz muss seine schwer krebskranke Frau pflegen. Sein Spielraum reicht grad mal, intern die heiklen juristischen Angelegenheiten zu übersetzen. Damit hat er nämlich mehr Erfahrung. Alles Übrige bleibt an mir hängen, und das ist nicht wenig.

Ich versuch mein Bestes, euch auch auf Deutsch auf dem Laufenden zu halten. Aber ich wär zeitlich echt überfordert, alles zweisprachig zu machen. Bitte hab Nachsicht!

...und diese (selbstgewählte) Aufgabe löst Ihr mit Bravour! Absolut bestaunenswert, wofür Euch die Community gar nicht genug danken kann. Ohne Euch wäre hier schon längst Alles auseinander gelaufen.

+1

Thank you for letting us know :-)

This is just brinkmanship. He's trying to panic IMA into cutting a deal that they cannot afford - or somehow pass damaging liability to IMA. In view of his past behaviour, I don't see any reason to trust his word.
I see that the site is still encouraging 12 month and 24 month subscription renewals. How ethical is that when the site is about to close, and the money kept by IP?

My very private opinion: It isnt' ethical at all! It is pure fear of getting bankrupt with the consequence, not to be allowed to lead companies for the next 15 years. It's a conspicious trial, not to bear the responsibility for one's own big mistakes in the past. Whereabouts the problem? Many people try a business with good ideas, but fail to bring it to the real life. Afterwards they work as normal employees, as most people do. Pay their debts, and the cake is eaten.

My point of view.

This is not a situation where some company is buying another company. This is more like a company itself looking for a possibility to give it's assets to a members association.

At the same time people want to get informed, but the IMA representatives are bound not to reveal anything that would risk Ipernity S.A.'s confidentiality. IMA gets blamed for not telling enough or telling too much, no matter what we do. I do understand emotions start to affect when time seem to be running out. Even I feel betrayed for not been told enough, and not soon enough to fully understand how delicate and complex the process is.

So, the decision to tell people, Christophe Ruelle, President and CEO of Ipernity S.A. has accepted IMA's proposal, was very likely somewhat premature. This was done trusting and hoping Christophe would also confirm his acceptance as he had promised, which he also finally did after several days.

I personally think we are now in a standoff aka stalemate situation. IMA wants some proof to release the crowdfunding money to be used for paying the costs until takeover can be legalized. But Ipernity S.A. can't give that proof for some suddenly appeared legal reasons, which seem to prolong the process much further than we IMA representatives expected.

In my opinion the only way out is a full transparency from Ipernity S.A.'s side. This requires some sort of a signed pre-contract to be made, and it should be made very soon. IMA could let the crowdfunding money to be used until the legal process and signed agreement could be finally done. Ipernity S.A. would be obligated to reveal all it's accountancy to IMA until the takeover becomes legalized.

Then what comes to possible future and issues like who would be the IMA officers until the first board elections becomes done, I say we can only ask you to trust those obligations on the hands of the current IMA representatives. I personally hope being able to avoid any of those responsibilities in practice. Not that I wouldn't see myself as a trustworthy, but seeing myself way too busy to take some of those responsibilities. One thing I can promise is that I would do my best to try keeping people informed. And if I would get help on providing translations to German, French, and maybe even to more languages, then that would be much appreciated.

Please everyone, blame me for this comment, if I have revealed too much or not enough. I wish you all a great and pleasant week =)

Even if Ipernity S.A.give full transparency and sign a legally binding pre-contract how can we know the process won't be dragged out again until all the crowd funding money is used up? Just wondering... I trust IMA to take this into account and protect our interests.

Don Sutherland is firm in spreadsheets, numbers and figures. He made bestcase and worstcase calculations. After all it is realistic to make this trial. But of course there is no final security.

My point of view again.

We have already got two months more time to use this space than expected. And it looks like several weeks (even over a month) more will pass before the process can be legalized. It means the crowdfunding money would have at least bought us approximately three months to hang around here.

Here's also a suggestion what could be done if everything fails after all. Rest of the crowdfunding money could be given to some charity. The idea is to run the service as long as the takeover process takes, but not to ask people to invest on membership fees before the takeover is indeed signed and confirmed.

But this is just a suggestion. At the moment I see we need to make all kinds of suggestions, even crazy ones, if we wish to put some end of this situation. I personally start to feel very exhausted because of yet more twists and turns, and I most certainly hope we find some solution by the end of this week.

As I understand the situation of the crowdfunding funds. These funds will not be touched unless the IMA become 100% owners of the Ipernity site.
In the latested IMA Blogg where we were informed Christophe had changed his mind about the IMA taking over the IP/SA site.
William said "p.s. To protect everyone, Indiegogo will not be permitted to transfer funds to IMA's account so that refunds can be facilitated if they should be needed".

Exactly so.

And that is why I said we are in the stalemate situation. IMA has promised to cover the costs for the time that process would take, but not before takeover becomes legalized. Now suddenly and truly unexpectedly it looks like the process would take much longer than expected. We soon (somewhat by the end of this week) have to find out if there are any way to solve the situation in a way that pleases everyone.

I truly believe the situation has taken surprise also Mr Ruelle, that the legalization would take so long.

I hope Mr Ruelle is also reading at least some of the discussion here after all. We definitely have to build up some trust on both sides if we truly wish IMA to take over Ipernity. I personally really don't know how to solve this situation.

Sami... please be certain of this ... I DO NOT AND NEVER WILL BLAME YOU.....OR ANY IMA PERSON FOR ANYTHING IN THIS DEAL !!!!

I would only blame if one of you ran off with the money and didnt take us all to the Caribbean with you ! Seriously... I have COMPLETE faith(and its not exactly blind faith) in the IMA

An alle (nicht als offizielles Statement, nur als persönliches Update von mir, um euch auf dem Laufenden zu halten):

Erstens: Inzwischen ist es 12:01 Uhr MEZ. Es liegt immer noch kein Vorschlag von Christophe Ruelle vor. Wäre er mein Angestellter, wäre spätestens jetzt eine formale juristisch wirksame Abmahnung auszusprechen: „Schweres persönliches Fehlverhalten wegen Nichteinhalten wichtiger Abgabetermine ohne triftigen Grund trotz mehrfacher Ermahnung und daraus resultierender schwerer Störung von betrieblichen Abläufen.“

Am Sonntag hatte CR angekündigt, er wolle Montagmorgen etwas vorlegen. Am Montag hat er den Termin auf heute morgen verschoben. Und wiederum hat er den (selbst vorgeschlagenen) Termin nicht eingehalten. (In USA würde man ihn wahrscheinlich gleich rausschmeißen.)

Als Konsequenz konnte ich auch nichts durchschauen und ggf. etwas für William Sutherland vorbereiten. In New York ist es jetzt 06:01 CET. William steht jetzt auf, und kann sich zwei Stunden lang – neben dem frühstück – um Ipernity kümmern. Danach muss er zur Arbeit, wo nichtdienstliche Mails und Telefonate verboten sind. Bei Don in Oregon ist es noch 03:01 nachts. Wenn William keine Vorlage zum Bearbeiten hat, kann Don nachher auch nichts machen. So vergeht wieder ein Tag völlig nutzlos, weil Herr Ruelle es nicht für nötig hält, Vereinbarungen einzuhalten.

Zweitens: Es liegt auch immer noch kein Entwurf des Rechtsanwalts von Mr. Ruelle vor. Denn nach französischem Recht reicht es für Geschäftsvorgänge nicht aus, ein Agreement per Mail zu treffen. (Zum Glück, s.o.) Der Verkäufer muss mindestens einen notariell beglaubigten Vorvertrag, der bestimmten formalen Regel entsprechen muss, vorlegen. In Frankreich heißt das: Promesse de vente.

Da die IMA-Mitglieder in verschiedenen Zeitzonen zu Hause sind, brauchen wir mindestens eine Erdumdrehung lang Zeit, den Entwurf zu prüfen, bevor er unterschrieben werden kann. Bei ggf. erforderlichen Korrekturen und internen Abstimmungen zwei Erdumdrehungen.

Es ist mir völlig schleierhaft, wie Christophe Ruelle die Deadline, die von Generosity vorgegeben ist (für die Vertragsabgabe Freitag, 28. April, ausreichend frühzeitig vor Dienstschluss bei Generosity in Kalifornien), einhalten will. Aber warten wir weiterhin auf Wunder . . .

~~~~~

To all (not as an official statement, only as an individual update fromm e, to keep you informed):

First: In the meantime it is 12:01 CET. We didn’t receive any proposal from Christophe Ruelle yet. If he would be an employee of mine, I would give him a written legal warning now, because of “ severe individual misbehavior, by not meeting important deadlines without any cogent reason despite of several admonitions with the consequence of severe disruption of operational processes.”

On Sunday CR had announced to present the last „1%“ at Monday morning. Nothing happened. On Monday afternoon he announced, he would presentate it this morning. Nothing happened again. (Within the States he wouls be fired immediately now.)

As a consequence I wasn’t able to check anything or to prepare something for William Sutherland. It is 06:01 in New York now. William is getting up now and has two hours to do things for IMA. Afterwards – at his working place – he has no possibility, because it’s forbidden there to do private mailing or phone calls. In Oregon, where Don lives, it is 03:01 CET nighttime.
If William has nothing to work with, Don will have anything afterward as consequence. By that another day will elpase fort he whole procress – only because of Mr. Ruelles unreliability.

Secondly: We didn’t also receive any proposal of the formal pre-contract form Mr. Ruelles lawyer! ((the “Promesse de vente“).

Because the members of IMA are living around the globe, they need at least one turn (24hrs) to check such a proposal, bevor it may be released for undersigning. If corrections are necessary, it take another whole day.

It is incomprehensible, how Mr. Ruelle wants to meet the time-out, which is given by Generosity. But instead of complaining let’ pray and hope, God will help him.

Vielen Dank für deinen ausführlichen Bericht und deine Zeit und Mühe die du investierst!

Es ist schon hart und für euch ganz besonders, diese Ungewissheit auszuhalten, wenn die Zeit zwischen den Fingern zerrinnt!
Ihr gebt euer Bestes, Danke!

Thankyou Bergfex !

Jaap asked elewhere:
"Did you read this 'news': www.ipernity.com/blog/team/4659406 ??
CR is talking about an email to IMA ??"

My answer:

Yes, we received that e-mail. But it doesn't contain any new facts. It's nothing more than an abstract about what happened the last few weeks, with the purpose to inform Claus-Peter, who had offered his help. The proposal itself and the lawyers draft of the pre-contract are not contained.

~~~~~

Ja, wir haben eine e-mail von Christophe erhalten. Aber sie enthält keine neuen Fakten. In ihr werden lediglich die Vorgänge der letzten Wochen für Claus-Peter zusammengefasst, der seine Hilfe angeboten hatte. Die angekündigten neuen Vorschläge fehlen ebenso wie der anwaltliche Entwurf des Vor-Vertrages.

Gaebe es keinen Vertrag mit ipernity und mir, der am 29.05.2018 endet, waere ich hier nicht mehr aktiv!

Kommt endlich in die Gaenge!!!!

Wie ist denn nun aktuell der Stand der Dinge?