#SaveYourInternet

love it..............

Please read the caption, and you may not like that ;-)

Even for authors this would be a disaster, when most of the photo sharing web sites would have to close offering platforms to share one's works.

My son already talked about that many monthes ago, it doesn`t sound very good

I have totally missed it =(

This really can close also ipernity! We can't afford to implement any filters! And we can't afford to pay for any possible copyright infringement lawsuits raised against the ipernity members association either. We all would become responsible on something done by few ignorant users.

This is the same SOPA and PIPA in 2012: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protests_against_SOPA_and_PIPA

Unfortunately, there are not so few ignorant users, as it seems, Sami, and too few use the possibility of already existing filters - at least related to photos and paintings as well as to street art that is not always public domain, etc. -, which can minimize error or unreliability by using several providers at least. Alone here at ipernity, images are favored either unsuspectingly or carelessly, which are either supposedly public domain pictures from the internet or demonstrably the property of others, what promotes copyright infringement...

You are right. And I admit being guilty as well =(

I have tried to clean my own closets lately from mistakes done before, as I have tried to become more observant on what to like (fave).

But the filters what there are talked about on Julia Reda's article are probably some automatic filters: juliareda.eu/2017/09/when-filters-fail

So, a service provider like ima first of all can't afford to get one, they are not reliable, and most likely such filters only serves rich stake holders only (e.g. Disney).

Re. " I have tried to clean my own closets lately from mistakes done before (...) ", that's what counts.
Regarding the filters Julia Reda mentioned, I guess the same as you and hope for the best for institutions like ipernity, as mentioned in my comment below.

Perhaps one can even assume that the Internet, as we know it today...
will change completely. And not necessarily to our advantage.

That is unfortunately very possible =(

This does not sound good at all... this "makes the bed" of the biggest photosharing and the death of little ones like ours...
Like supermarket chains killed small shops and asphixiate small producers.

Moreover, this whole thing probably serves only the rich companies to protect their copyright, like Disney. New starting artist can't afford to get their works published, not to mention getting their works included into any automatic but still expensive filtering what probably is then required.

Hab --> das hier gelesen, ich glaube, du hast Recht mit deinen Bedenken, Sami!

ganz abgesehen von Urheberrechtsproblemen - wenn es erst einmal die technische Möglichkeit und Verpflichtung gibt, Meinungsäußerungen vor Veröffentlichung auf bestimmte Muster zu überprüfen, ist es ein leichtes, auch alle Beiträge, die bspw. ein Stichwort wie Glyphosat enthalten, bereits vor Veröffentlichung zu blockieren.
In unserer Gesellschaft, in der mittlerweile ein Großteil der Diskussion online stattfindet, ist das tödlich für Freiheit und Demokratie.

A good find on this issue, Volker!

More or less stating the same worry that I have. Only the big companies and stake holders can then survive.

@All - The same article is also available in English: thehmm.nl/is-article-13-really-the-end-of-the-open-internet

Das sehe ich auch so, denn Filter, die aus dem Kontext erkennen, was gemeint ist, kann es garnicht geben, also werden sich das die kapitalkräftigen Unternehmen zum Nachteil anderer zunutze machen.

l'UE va finir par détruire toutes nos libertés

So it seem to be the case =(

So much for citizens rights....
This article could do with being in a more prominent position.

Please consider to share the word yourself. I changed the license of this photo to free use, and that includes the caption, of course.

Or use image of your own, or just a black square. Moreover, PicMonkey gives you tools to add text on images easily.

Thank you for sharing this Sami. As an American I didn't know this was going on. I like your picture to illustrate this ... the vignette is perfect.

I believe you have heard about the SOPA and PIPA case in 2012(?)

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protests_against_SOPA_and_PIPA

That was more or less similar case then.

O_O

(๏⏠๏)

Thanks very much for this important contribution, Sami! I think if we don't surrender defenselessly, we all have a good chance of protecting our rights, including our citizens' and human rights.

Yes, we can at least try.

Caption updated ;-)

A good appeal, Sami! And at least we should always try... but not half-heartedly. ;)
I hope the best for institutions like ipernity.
Have a great weekend.

A perfect picture to make noise about this issue, Sami. I cannot bear to deal with this garbage, politics makes me totally crazy and infuriated...to think that our internet rights are being batted about by those above....ARGHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!! *sticks head in the sand again, singing "LAHLAHLAHLAHLAHLAHICANNOTHEARANYTHINGIDONTWANTTOKNOWWHATICANNOTCHANGE"*

BTW, I wanted to thank you so much for your comments on my pictures. You're wonderful. You make me happy and you make me smile, and I love to read your opinions and feelings because dude, I totally love and respect your eye, your style, your ideas, and that brilliant mind behind the lens. It's awesome to me that you like my photography because I sure do find you to be quite the inspiration! *big hugs*

Oh, you make me blush, Janet =)

And the feeling goes both ways. Your creativity (especially including your wonderful stories) inspires me to continue here.

Wonderful image, Sami.

But what a nightmare if this goes into effect. :(

Yes, it can mean the end of ipernity as well! =(

And it's so annoying how they try to make people think it's for their own good. Sorry, but we're not stupid.

The only people this regulation will benefit are the corporate faceless ones who pull the strings of the unelected bureaucrats in Brussels.

It's really sickening and it's happening all over too. I don't know what we can do about it either. I sign all the petitions I can.

good picture.
I wrote to our Member of the EP already some months ago - but didn't get any response at all. Seems our Bavarian "state party" seems to be very aloof.....
hoping for the next elections.

I did the same, and don't expect to get any reply either =(

actually my son wrote to Heidi Hautala and he got an answer :)

Well, but I assume Heidi Hautala is against this Article 13 ;-)

I guess it is much more difficult to get those in favor to change their opinion and even reply.

Ich habe auch geschrieben, Markus. Ich denke, eine Antwort ist eher ungewöhnlich bei den vielen Zuschriften, die die Abgeordneten erhalten, aber ich hoffe, es ist nicht ganz umsonst.

yes, she voted against it

klasse samen gang

I just signed the online petition, thanks !

Good point! I did that as well early this morning. I need to add that link to caption as well.

Excellent !

Except not what is said on the caption(?) ;-/

interesting times, indeed!

I hope not for the worse.

With every EU regulation I perceive more abuse to our civil rights :(

Ugh! Everything is "going to hell in a handbasket" these days.

YES all fotos on Panoramio ;-(((((

While I share the scepticism about Article 13 to a high degree not everything posted in the internet about it is fully accurate. The current text of Article 13 doesn't explicitely require upload filter. But people fear that the requirements of Article 13 might only be met by upload filters. On the other hand Article 13 says the measures shall be "proportionate". Here is the original text:

Information society service providers that store and provide to the public access to large amounts of works or other subject-matter uploaded by their users shall, in cooperation with rightholders, take measures to ensure the functioning of agreements concluded with rightholders for the use of their works or other subject-matter or to prevent the availability on their services of works or other subject-matter identified by rightholders through the cooperation with the service providers. Those measures, such as the use of effective content recognition technologies, shall be appropriate and proportionate.

If upload filters are that expensive that a platform can't survive I doubt that this would be "proportionate". So even if Article 13 stays at it is it is not clear that platforms like ipernity will have to use expensive upload filters.

Good point and valid addition to the discussion, Guido!

I guess then "...measures, such as the use of effective content recognition technologies, shall be appropriate and proportionate" could be something like the community itself doing the moderation.

So far we have tried to avoid dealing with any difficult copyright infringement cases. If anything, we have said it should be between the legal copyright owner and the one who breaches the copyright.

But if we then start to "wash laundry" together, we may start a "Spanish inquisition". And a lot of time and effort spent on trying to filter the contents based on human opinion.

Machine based filter is equally error prone. But then at least one can blame the machine =D

Yep !
... I signed the petition (Wikipedia had a link). But statistically 44 % of the people don't understand, what the coming law means. I'm one of the 44%. Article 13 is meant for youtube and other giants - but the filter-idea will kill all the small, tiny platforms, or ???

Ich schätze, die Verfasserin versteht, was sie gemeint hat. Aber sie versteht sicherlich auch nicht, was daraus werden kann. Das weiß wohl niemand

I am sure that 44% is grossly underestimated. I am quite sure that almost 100 % (including me) don't understand what the coming laws mean. May the new laws cause problems for small platforms? Probably. Will all small platforms have to be shut down? I don't believe. I am NOT an expert in copyright law but I have seen public debates about legal topics where I am an expert in. Such public debates very often tend to present facts in a distorted and one-sided manner. Therefore I am a little bit cautious with respect to Article 13.

From what I have read (and I have to admit that I haven't read that much about this topic) it appears that the proportionality principle is an important part of Article 13. Proportionality means that everybody has to meet a requirement but the way how someone can meet the requirement depends on criterias like size, resources and risk. So tiny platforms like ipernity certainly are not expected to make the same efforts in order to prevent copyright infringements like Google or other internet giants. And I would like to add that Article 13 doesn't require platforms to prevent 100% of copyright infringements. They have to make reasonable efforts to prevent copyright infringements. And what is reasonable certainly is different for Google and ipernity.

Further more I would like to stress that EU directives still need to be implemented in national law. It seems that Article 13 lets some room for interpretation that can lead to different implementations among EU members. Therefore it is probably much too early to accurately assess the precise impact of Article 13.

Yep! Signed!
To be sure I signed 10 times! :-)
Just kidding :-))

LOL! =D

That is the problem with such online petitions ;-) So, I don't wonder why some politicians does not take them seriously.

Unfortunately the copyright reform went through:

twitter.com/Senficon/status/1110509970213294081

:(

Part of a twit from Mr. Morawiecki, Polish prime minister
twitter.com/MorawieckiM/status/1110652329609625600 :

We were, we are and we will always be for freedom on the Internet.

All MEPs coming from Poland's ruling party, Law and Justice (PiS), voted against this ACTA2 ruling.
All my MEPs voted against the reform.

Unfortunately I can't say the same about Finnish MEPs =(

Fortunately it is not law yet.
To become law it has to be approved by a majority of EU countries.
Then it has to be implemented into each individual EU country law.
Implementations may differ... We shall see what happens.

Yes, and in some peculiar way I feel excited to see what will happen. This can also have positive results. For example we get more independent (user owned) service providers, and because of article 11 plans to forbid citing news articles, it may lead to total destruction of news agencies. Moreover, we may see "dark net" become even more popular than it already is.

Looks like we are on the same page here, Sami :)
I am laughing now because two days ago, just after the voting, I explained darknet to my Mom who was (and is) very concerned about this last ruling. She is (almost) 90 years old, but she is an avid Internet user and is able to grasp things better then some politicians. Darknet was new to her though, she wanted to know how it would work. "Just like the underground education in Poland during WWII", I said. "OK, I can do that", said my Mom, who graduated from underground high school, when she was a teenager at that time.

;-)))))

Never heard about underground education in Poland during WWII before. What a clever and thoughtful thing to do during desperate times!

Yes, people can have different opinions about dark net as well, but like anything, it may have also positive sides. Just like most of the people think that "hackers" do only bad things. There is actually significant differentiation done in "computer slang":

"Hacker" is so called "white hat" geek who tries to improve things by spotting the loop holes or improving things.

Then "cracker" is someone who does nothing but harm or seeks only personal gain.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Security_hacker#Classifications

Very good source.
Thank you.
Will comment after will complete reading

You are welcome. Always happy to help people finding relevant information.

Great shot Sami Well done Regards Tess. Thanks for the info provided here.

Glad to help. There is of course a danger to miss the context. So, in order to fully understand the EU's new copyright directive, it is recommended to read through it.

One never knows if there are even some "loopholes" ;-)

In Poland during WWII we had and underground state, complete with a government, an army, schools and courts. See the short film from our IPN (Institute of National Remembrance):
The Inconquered.
BTW it is public domain with attribution, so it is OK to put the link here :)
The point is, Polish were and are quite good with highly organized, clandestine operations ;)
And I know some really good hackers, too :)

Yes, of course giving links is okay =)

See my fresh addition up there on caption.

And thank you for that extra information, Marta =)

Special Job!!!

great work and very good notes !

Hi Sami


Great composition!

Now, if and when England leaves the EU, do we have to obey this copyright rule!!

Best Wishes, and a good weekend
Peter

Belated reply, sorry... Busy weekend because of grandchildren and iga2019...

No, you no longer need to obey any EU laws and directives, I think. Meaning that obviously if and when Brexit becomes ratified, England of course has laws of it's own.

But how this new EU copyright directive becomes implemented inside EU is also still open.

And if you refer to ipernity as we, then we supposedly have to follow French laws.